Have you finished both Cradle books too quickly? Do you wish there was something else you could read to scratch that itch? Are you sharpening your pitchfork right now because I'm writing something that isn't Blackflame? Well, you're in luck! Cradle was my humble, meager attempt to write a story in the xianxia* genre: a subcategory of Chinese novels that have grown popular on the English-speaking Internet over the last couple of years thanks to sites like WuxiaWorld and GravityTales (not to mention the hard-working, dedicated, good-looking fan translators who provide such works to lazy monolingual English-speakers like myself). I've had a lot of people ask me if Cradle was inspired by these Chinese works, and I usually respond by saying "Absolutely!" and then listing my favorites. It's the reason why I chose to put Unsouled in the Asian Myths and Legends category of Kindle fantasy. But after tonight, when people ask me these questions, I don't have to type out an answer every time! I can just link them back to this post! Behold, as my laziness sheds its skin to reveal its true shape! IF YOU DON'T SEE THE REST OF THIS POST, CLICK "READ MORE"! First of all, some basic information:
*In a nutshell: "xianxia" is a Chinese genre blending martial arts with magic and mythology in an often fantastic setting. This is the genre in which Cradle would fall. "Wuxia" is a similar genre with a greater focus on more "realistic" martial arts and a more historical (although not necessarily truly historical) setting. For those sticklers among you sharpening your keyboards, I'm aware that this is an oversimplification and that there's lots of overlap between the two genres. But this is the gist. Basically? It's magical martial arts. Even cooler than it sounds, if that's possible. Often the protagonists start from the bottom, working their way up through a variety of adventures until they become God-King of the Universe or whatever. You can see why it appeals to me so much. The stories tend to be very long and very light on description, with a focus on constant action. Sound good? Sound like something you might be into? In that case, here's a list of my personal favorites (in no particular order): Against the Gods, Desolate Era, Coiling Dragon, Martial World, Spirit Realm, Heavenly Jewel Change, and Sovereign of the Three Realms, among others. I Shall Seal the Heavens, or ISSTH, is worth a mention because it's very popular and has a protagonist similar to Lindon...or so I'm told, but I haven't read it, so I can't vouch for the story myself. Lots of these books are hosted (in English) on popular sites like WuxiaWorld and GravityTales, though many independent translators have their own sites. And many wuxia/xianxia stories are originally written and released online at a rate of a chapter per day, which is...staggering. If I could do that with Cradle, you'd have a new book every month and change (depending on how long I made the chapters). If you're diving in, which I do recommend, you should be aware of these three caveats, which may affect your personal enjoyment of the stories: 1.) Some of these stories treat women characters in a way that makes me uncomfortable. Normally this is a sense you get from occasional lines in the work, like "Every woman likes to have a man to rely on," or something similar. I don't have any idea how a Chinese reader takes lines like this--maybe there's cultural context I'm missing, or in the original language these lines mean something entirely different--but speaking solely for me personally, these sentiments make me uncomfortable. In part, Yerin and Suriel are my reaction against this tendency of the genre. Not every story does this, and it's not always overt, but it's something to be aware of. If this is a particularly sensitive issue for you, I'd recommend going to Reddit's r/NovelTranslations or a similar community and asking for works to seek out / avoid. 2.) The English has its flaws. Please don't treat this as any sort of dig at the translators, because they're all heroic avatars of diligence with stupendous haircuts. But any translated work is going to have elements that get lost in translation, and even the original versions of these chapters are often written in a single day. They have repetitive lines, typos, and unclear sentences in their original language, much less in English. Bottom line: power through it. This isn't worth getting hung up on, IMO. Don't have a heart attack if you see a sentence ending in a preposition, or if someone says the word "actually" four sentences in a row. 3.) The main character is almost always brokenly overpowered. This is rarely ever a deal-breaker for me, because I know what I'm getting into. But if you're diving into wuxia/xianxia novels for the first time, you should know you're not signing up to watch a guy become "moderately okay" at martial arts and then die in his sleep. You're strapping in to experience an underachieving but humble young man stumble upon the greatest weapon in all existence and then use that weapon to carve out the hearts of dragons, get revenge on anyone who ever wronged him, and murder his way up the power scale until he transforms himself one step at a time into a literal god who extinguishes stars with a punch. Cradle is my attempt at adapting the strengths of the genre while steering away from what I consider to be its weaknesses (although I don't promise flawless English). Lindon won't succeed every time, and sometimes he might regret it even when he does. Plus, he's not taking this journey alone. But if what I've described sounds awesome to you, check it out right now! There's literally millions of pages of magical martial arts out there, waiting to be devoured. By you. -Will
84 Comments
Keith
11/13/2016 10:15:50 pm
Thanks for the insight Will. Can't wait to read more Cradle but I guess I can read some of these in the meantime.
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Keith
11/18/2016 04:40:32 am
So I decided to read Soulsmith again instead haha. The possibilities you showed for Lindons future, are they glimpses at the next book or a big misdirect?
Well, I can't complain that you decided to re-read Soulsmith.
Tom
12/9/2016 03:56:15 am
I would recommend trying these
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Matt
11/13/2016 10:58:21 pm
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Joseph
11/14/2016 11:38:11 am
I find Lindon has more in common with Tavi from Jim Butcher's Furies of Calderon than with most xianxia heroes. Matter of fact, if you like the general plot of Cradle and don't mind changing cultures to Roman, FoC is a finished 6 book series to enjoy while waiting on Lindon's exploits.
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I can see the similarities between Lindon and Tavi, though I'm not sure Codex Alera is similar to Cradle.
Deathblade seems like an awesome guy, and I know ISSTH gets praised to high heavens (ba-dum-psh), but I could never get past the first few chapters. I should give it a better try, though.
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Jacob Carasso
11/16/2016 10:31:23 am
I would REALLY recommend ISSTH because it is one of the most well written books in the genre. There are also so other really nice stories out there.
Dylan Grossman
4/15/2019 12:12:53 pm
I couldnt get into ISSTH either. It was just too dark and plodding for me. I recommend LoHP if you havent read it. Super interesting power system there. Also Fishing the Myriad heavens is amazing albeit the translations stopped at like the best part.
Leandre Honore
5/5/2020 04:41:43 am
i almost feel like will is eithan right now
Ben
11/13/2016 11:15:02 pm
I've read my fair share of xianxia stories, and love your take on the genre with Cradle. I feel like you've got a great handle on the mix of the original tropes and themes of the genre, while still being a book that is definitely yours in tone and style. It's also really nice to read a story like this where English was the original intended language.
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Thanks, Ben!
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Ben
11/15/2016 09:57:22 am
I think establishing a big, near impossible goal right from the start for Lindon was a great call too. Too often in xianxia/wuxia, it feels like there's not really an endgame in mind through much of it. Protagonists get stronger simply for the sake of..well, getting stronger. As if 'becoming more powerful' was the highest calling for character motivation (granted, these are often male power fantasies). Too many authors just hand wave it as 'just the way it is' in this genre. If you're a korean or chinese xianxia author, it's like you're issued a checklist of tropes that must be hit in the course of your story if you want to sell to your demographic. Same as if you do high fantasy over here- elves who love nature, check. Dwarves who love rocks, check. Halflings who are childlike, check. It's so very restricting and leads to stories that feel stale.
Showing the high end of the power scale was important to me, because it fundamentally affects what you expect out of the story. Like you said--real xianxia authors can get away with it because it's an expected trope of the genre, so you often just assume they're going to be picking their teeth with planets by the end.
jim
11/14/2016 07:01:08 pm
I'm reading/skimming "Blue silver" and getting a little (very) disenchanted because every "struggle" (I don't think there are any to be honest... maybe feeling "the worst pain of his life" every chapter when he advances a power level) seems like it's solved by revealing a secret power the main character just activated.
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Blue Silver? Isn't that the name of a translation group?
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Jim
11/15/2016 02:19:23 pm
It was, yeah.
Okay, good. I had worried that I was going off on a tangent for no reason.
Empty
11/14/2016 08:58:27 pm
Aha, Desolate Era is currently my fav. I wish the translations of Lord Xue Xing could come out faster, currently reading the mtl of it. Lord Xue Xing is IET's current series. (he actually writes chapters faster than they can be translated)
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Desolate Era was my favorite for a long time, but shortly after he completed the [SPOILER-FREE] big tournament and started training under his [SPOILER-FREE] new master, my interest waned.
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Empty
11/17/2016 05:58:53 pm
Yeah, all of I.E.T's novels follow similar formats. The character is hot stuff for a while, but they soon discover they have a ways to go. I'll just say that there is a lot about the world of DE that Ji Ning and other characters don't know about.
Mick
11/15/2016 07:07:46 pm
Is it possible at the end of the next book to have a short glossary that has the known power scales (copper, iron, jade, etc), key attributes of each scale and known paths?
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Luke
11/16/2016 10:05:10 am
I would really like that, because so far all we have to go with is Yerin's and Eithan's explanation of things.
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Brian C
11/16/2016 03:31:17 pm
Are you sure that's wise to put it as a link? I know it is more work to put in the books but what if the glossary becomes somewhat spoiler-ish in terms of powers individuals get when they "level up" as it were? What I mean by this as the story develops the glossary will/should be updated but can't that spoil some of the older stories for new readers who have just discovered your works? I know this seems like a big "what-if" but it's something that might ruin a big moment down the line for some readers. Hopefully you can make sense of what I'm trying to say.
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I'm not sure, no.
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Jim
11/17/2016 09:43:18 am
Totally agree on the 89% bit.
John Vargin
11/21/2016 02:47:39 pm
Right?! This last 11% nonsense that some of these 'epic' book include is a bummer, to be succinct. Blood Mirror was the last one to do it to me as well. Definitely a link, not an index of info-dump at the end.
Greg
11/17/2016 11:12:12 am
I'd also recommend Stellar Transformations, it was the first one I'd read, and I'm pretty sure was the first to be seriously translated. It's what pretty much inspired the creation of Wuxiaworld.
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Greg
11/17/2016 04:55:01 pm
It's kinda sorta a prequel, as Linely does appear in it at one point. But other than Linely's appearance and a few other small things, it pretty much separate.
Will's publisher (not really)
11/17/2016 12:13:49 pm
"Will what are you doing posting on your blog when you should be getting me more books to publish get back to work slave." *multiple whip strikes in the background
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Mike
11/17/2016 10:33:26 pm
Is there any way to get these on an e-reader? I'd love to read these but it's so much harder to read large amounts of text on a computer monitor.
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Jacob Carasso
11/18/2016 10:33:09 am
The way I read everything is on my phone. The text scales just right so it is easy to read for me. It allows me to read anywhere.
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Man, thank God for Kindle Unlimited indeed. Some of my titles make more from a full KU read than from a sale.
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Lordofchaos
11/18/2016 01:53:46 pm
Are we gonna see the requisite pet companion in this book?
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Adarsh
11/19/2016 03:48:40 pm
Its the Sylvan Riverseed, isn't it?
Sean
11/18/2016 05:31:18 pm
So, is there a forum set up somewhere where we can start to guess what is going to happen and theorize how Lindon is going to overcome his next couple obstacles?
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Caleb Chamberlain
11/19/2016 04:40:02 pm
Thanks for this!
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Tyson Something
11/20/2016 08:00:19 pm
I tried to read some of I Shall Seal the Heavens based on comments here. Couldn't quite get past chapter 7 and this nonsense...
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Jordan
11/22/2016 07:10:31 pm
While I wait and wait and wait... I'll go back to reread my favorite series.... travelers gate... lol
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Nimish
11/23/2016 09:11:11 am
Anybody thought bout the fact that cause he Lindon has two cores he could also get two gold bond thing-o-a-jig, cause both his cores advance separately.
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ben
11/23/2016 11:52:07 am
I was re-reading Unsouled + Soulsmith while visiting my parents for Thanksgiving, and this passage in Unsouled particularly caught my attention where Lindon read of some fanciful legends that included "...the mythical 'true badges' that amplified the power of human madra..."
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John
11/23/2016 08:46:38 pm
Hi Will,
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shai
11/23/2016 10:10:21 pm
Hey! So I just tried reading ISSTH. Because I love a protagonist getting insanely powerful I was excited - and the idea of a lindon-esque character doing in a full series seemed great. Unfotunately I was sorely disappointed. The so called "cleverness" of the character was all but non existent - a 10 yo could come up with his schemes, and every one is naive enough to fall for his scheme/flattery or incredibly impressed by his cunning. It honestly read like the author jerking off on the thought of his own brilliance. With a clutzy side kick whos entire role seems to be jerking off the protagonist's ego - kind of like a pocket p***y for the author.
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I can't defend or attack anything about ISSTH specifically, because I haven't read enough of it.
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Lightsyde
11/26/2016 11:40:50 am
Hey Will,
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You know, that's a good question.
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Jacob Carasso
11/30/2016 05:47:28 pm
Martial World or True Martial World?
Jeffery Wells
12/12/2016 09:28:41 pm
Hello!
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I'm glad you're enjoying the stories, Jeff!
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Havoc
1/29/2017 11:05:30 pm
"So I'm trying to make sure that whenever Lindon starts feeling like the biggest fish around, he gets moved to a bigger pond."
Ryan
12/27/2016 04:56:04 pm
When is an approximate release date for black fire, as I loved the earlier books?
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Prince
7/13/2017 08:09:46 am
Just read Cradle (all 3) on the recommendation of Deathblade – the translator for ISSTH. The story's great and adds a dimension of depth and scope to the antagonists. I don't have to keep telling myself 'cultivating makes you half-retarded' where characters are properly developed and have more than one beat.
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Erwin
5/20/2018 08:37:43 am
For ISSTH, it improves remarkably after the first two books - so - if you are having trouble getting into it - pressing onwards was worthwhile to me.
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Dustin
5/8/2018 05:02:58 am
Hey Will, just wanted to say thanks for writing this article! I've spent the last couple of weeks reading the crap out of WuxiaWorld, and I'm enjoying every minute of it!
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Guils
7/31/2018 11:31:02 pm
I've started reading gravitytales but I come from the litrpg genre. RSSG is surprisingly good.
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Andy
8/7/2018 02:54:15 pm
Just reread Unsouled through Ghostwater. Can't express how much I enjoy your vision and execution. When I have had these stories to turn to when I have some quiet moments have been some of the most enjoyable of times. Love your characters and the consistency that you give the dialogues along with the humor you throw in. I hope to continue with you to the End of the Sacred Arts. Come on UNDERLORD!!!
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Wei Hong
4/11/2023 03:58:31 am
Hi Will, I was just wondering have u read any of Jin Yong’s novels. They are more wu xia than xian xia though. I’m currently reading book 4 of cradle. It’s so good!
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